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Post by tylerjacobs on Jul 2, 2008 5:42:37 GMT -6
So him putting over Goldberg, Shelton Benjamin, Randy Orton and others never happened?
Just because you dislike HHH doesn't mean he's worked hard and put people over.
I hate Ric Flair, but I respect everything he's done. Stop being so *** damn close minded.
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JFK
Full Member
The dominant gene.
Posts: 547
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Post by JFK on Jul 2, 2008 12:44:31 GMT -6
Foley loves the business since when? from what ive read (his books) and seen (his shoot interview) he's nothing more then a money grubbing whore.
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Post by Adam on Jul 2, 2008 17:07:02 GMT -6
So him putting over Goldberg, Shelton Benjamin, Randy Orton and others never happened? Just because you dislike HHH doesn't mean he's worked hard and put people over. I hate Ric Flair, but I respect everything he's done. Stop being so damn close minded. He didn't put Goldberg over... he was already over from WCW, being the first person to pin a guy in the company and then losing to him the next month isn't putting somebody over, sorry, doesn't work that way. Shelton Benjamin.... I'll kinda give you that one. Mainly because I don't remember it too well. Randy Orton, how did he put Orton over? He was the one who took the title from Orton during Orton's first run.... if anything it was Chris Benoit who put Orton over, by getting pinned cleanly by the heel. HHH doesn't put people over, remember when Rock got pinned by Hurricane and the very next week Hurricane gets destroyed by Triple H? Remember when the only person Trips would lose the belt to was Shawn Michaels? Remember him hitting the pedigree on Booker T and then taking 20.3 minutes to pin him? Remember the Triple H, who won the title fron Orton after Cena was stripped. Winning the world title from somebody, and then jobbing it back to them the same night isn't putting somebody over..... you still got the be freaking world champion, and still beat them the first time. When will people understand that losing to somebody isn't automatically "putting them over". It's doing your job. This is like saying Undertaker put Maven over by allowing Maven to get a cheap shot on him during the royal rumble, and then losing the hardcore title to him thanks to interference when Maven barely got any offense in. That's not putting somebody over.
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Post by Xavier Williams on Jul 2, 2008 17:22:25 GMT -6
Benjamin Batista Cena And most recently, Jeff Hardy
And really, who cares if he doesnt lay down for everyone
Goldberg and Steiner were busts Booker was on his way out And Orton FLOPPED in his face run
HHH paid his dues, and now he is reaping the rewards of being the top guy in the 'E.
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Post by Adam on Jul 2, 2008 17:42:03 GMT -6
Benjamin Batista Cena And most recently, Jeff Hardy And really, who cares if he doesnt lay down for everyone Goldberg and Steiner were busts Booker was on his way out And Orton FLOPPED in his face run HHH paid his dues, and now he is reaping the rewards of being the top guy in the 'E. **yawn** Simply Losing to somebody is not putting them over. If that were the only criteria to putting somebody over, then the man in my sig has put a lot of people over during his career. Andre The Giant, Undertaker, Big Show, Ultimate Warrior, and Goldberg..... just a quick list of 5 guys who won their very first world titles from him. Hogan must have been dang good at putting people over, and was reaping the benefits during his later years right? Triple H is a good wrestler... no denying that, and he used to be my favorite wrestler, but lets not deify him as some wrestling God who only has the title on his waist so he can boost the young guys, puhlease. He has the title because he's basically the boss now and he loves to be on top, not because he cares about Joe Everyman(heehee).
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Post by Alex Jones on Jul 2, 2008 18:45:48 GMT -6
It's not just wwe and it's not just trips..look at TNA....Christian put Kaz over in a great ladder match and now Kaz is back in the X-Division in the X cup..the moto city machine guns beat Team 3d but now they to are back in the X-cup...it happens everywhere but truth is Trips is a great performer and his time isn't over yet..once he's a bit older I'm sure he'll put over younger talent..IE CM Punk and Kofi Kingston...
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Post by Spike Kane on Jul 2, 2008 19:03:27 GMT -6
I wasn't trying to make out he's God or seomthing like that.
i just get fed up of "he only winz cuz he bangs da dawter LOLZ"
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Post by Philip Burns on Jul 2, 2008 20:32:40 GMT -6
Foley loves the business since when? from what ive read (his books) and seen (his shoot interview) he's nothing more then a money grubbing whore. thats the most blasphemous thing I have ever heard
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Post by Philip Burns on Jul 2, 2008 20:38:51 GMT -6
I bet if the McMahon Helmsly era stroyline had never happened nobody would care if he was married to Steph. Putting it out there was the first mistake
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Post by Dante Cross on Jul 2, 2008 21:18:26 GMT -6
We would of cared, Wrestling has changed alot since then, We went from the days of very little internet presence, to if you really ****ing wanted to, you could find out everything that happens before hand.
The Internet killed The Wrestling.
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JFK
Full Member
The dominant gene.
Posts: 547
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Post by JFK on Jul 2, 2008 21:34:17 GMT -6
Foley loves the business since when? from what ive read (his books) and seen (his shoot interview) he's nothing more then a money grubbing whore. thats the most blasphemous thing I have ever heard youve never seen his shoot then i recomend it his and ravens if nothing else We would of cared, Wrestling has changed alot since then, We went from the days of very little internet presence, to if you really f**king wanted to, you could find out everything that happens before hand. The Internet killed The Wrestling. I agree
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Post by Adam on Jul 2, 2008 21:37:44 GMT -6
We would of cared, Wrestling has changed alot since then, We went from the days of very little internet presence, to if you really f**king wanted to, you could find out everything that happens before hand. The Internet killed The Wrestling. It's hard to comprehend how much I agree with that statement at times.
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Chris Kahne
Junior Member
Branigan's Law is like Branigan's Love, hard and fast!
Posts: 419
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Post by Chris Kahne on Jul 2, 2008 22:46:42 GMT -6
I completely agree...it destroyed wrestling
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Post by Xavier Williams on Jul 2, 2008 23:47:09 GMT -6
Benjamin Batista Cena And most recently, Jeff Hardy And really, who cares if he doesnt lay down for everyone Goldberg and Steiner were busts Booker was on his way out And Orton FLOPPED in his face run HHH paid his dues, and now he is reaping the rewards of being the top guy in the 'E. **yawn** Simply Losing to somebody is not putting them over. If that were the only criteria to putting somebody over, then the man in my sig has put a lot of people over during his career. Andre The Giant, Undertaker, Big Show, Ultimate Warrior, and Goldberg..... just a quick list of 5 guys who won their very first world titles from him. Hogan must have been dang good at putting people over, and was reaping the benefits during his later years right? Triple H is a good wrestler... no denying that, and he used to be my favorite wrestler, but lets not deify him as some wrestling God who only has the title on his waist so he can boost the young guys, puhlease. He has the title because he's basically the boss now and he loves to be on top, not because he cares about Joe Everyman(heehee). By Benjamin getting 2-3 CLEAN wins over HHH that put him as a legit contender and showed that this kid had promise. NOBODY bought Batista as a talent and he went on to have his BEST matches with HHH before breaking out, and showing that he had some talent. That is a put over. Cena, at the time, lacked a major win under his belt and EVERYONE picked HHH to win at WM 22. And not only did he win, he got a TAP OUT victory, that is a put over. Jeff HArdy was getting talked into a major main event push and he, like Cena, lacked a major victory, so who do they call... you guessed it, Trips. In Hardy beating HHH, it made him look like a viable threat to Orton. HHH did the job and made these guys look good, the problem is what happens after he does so. And that mostly falls on the shoulders of Creative (Cena's title reign being too long) or the superstar failing (Shelton not improving on the mic, and Hardy's drug suspension)
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Post by Angel on Jul 3, 2008 5:42:22 GMT -6
Xavier is absolutely right. HHH may be a dick, he may love the belt more than wrestling itself, but he does put over people he atleast considers to be the future, He put over Benjamin three times in a row, I remember it. It's not HHH's fault Shelton dropped the ball. Batista beat him almost everytime they fought I believe. HHH only just beat Cean his first time at NOC. And he put over Jeff Hardy in a match no one will soon forget. Like I said, he only puts over people he thinks are going to be the future. And so far he has been right two out of four times. I say two because we will have to wait and see if Jeff can stay clean, and from what I've read Shelton is perfectly happy being a mid carder.
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Post by Adam on Jul 3, 2008 8:43:19 GMT -6
**yawn** Simply Losing to somebody is not putting them over. If that were the only criteria to putting somebody over, then the man in my sig has put a lot of people over during his career. Andre The Giant, Undertaker, Big Show, Ultimate Warrior, and Goldberg..... just a quick list of 5 guys who won their very first world titles from him. Hogan must have been dang good at putting people over, and was reaping the benefits during his later years right? Triple H is a good wrestler... no denying that, and he used to be my favorite wrestler, but lets not deify him as some wrestling God who only has the title on his waist so he can boost the young guys, puhlease. He has the title because he's basically the boss now and he loves to be on top, not because he cares about Joe Everyman(heehee). By Benjamin getting 2-3 CLEAN wins over HHH that put him as a legit contender and showed that this kid had promise. NOBODY bought Batista as a talent and he went on to have his BEST matches with HHH before breaking out, and showing that he had some talent. That is a put over. Cena, at the time, lacked a major win under his belt and EVERYONE picked HHH to win at WM 22. And not only did he win, he got a TAP OUT victory, that is a put over. Jeff HArdy was getting talked into a major main event push and he, like Cena, lacked a major victory, so who do they call... you guessed it, Trips. In Hardy beating HHH, it made him look like a viable threat to Orton. HHH did the job and made these guys look good, the problem is what happens after he does so. And that mostly falls on the shoulders of Creative (Cena's title reign being too long) or the superstar failing (Shelton not improving on the mic, and Hardy's drug suspension) What wrestler hasn't lost matches? What wrestler hasn't gone into a match simply to legitimize somebody's title reign? This is a sport that is centered around pre-determined outcomes. Losing to somebody.... is not putting them over automatically. We're talking about a guys mindset, why he does things. Did winning the title from Orton, then losing it back to him the same night count as putting Orton over? No.. because HHH still got to beat Orton, had to wrestle another match, and then lost... if anything it was Trips that came out looking over because he lost to the fresher Orton but still put up a great fight and still held the title. When Triple H lost the IC championship to Jeff Hardy.... that could have been classified as HHH putting Hardy over... but wait... HHH won the belt back 6 days later. Later Did Jeff Hardy defeat Triple H? Yes, but who was it that ultimately ended up with the title shot at wrestlemania? That's part of the business, sometimes you go over.... sometimes you have to put somebody else over. If losing to somebody in big matches is putting somebody over then Triple H doesn't even come close to the likes of Chris Jericho or Big Show..... two guys who aren't 12 time world champions, why aren't they "reaping the benefits" for paying their dues? Triple H is a 12 time world champion..... and he's married to the owner's daughter and is a member of the notorious Kliq...... coincidence? You have to be nieve to believe that.
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Post by Angel on Jul 3, 2008 10:27:05 GMT -6
Adam, you as well make a great point. All I think some of us are saying is he does put certain people over. Does he end up on top 90% of the time, of course, but on occasion, if he likes you, he'll put you over. I mean, not everyone can say they beat HHH, let alon in a big match situation. And when Orton won the title back, it was a last man standing match, and Orton definitely looked like the dominant one to me. I'm just saying. He's power hungry and he's obviously only really concerned with his own career, but he does put some people over.
Not like Show or Jericho, but to flip it around, Cena almost never puts over anyone.
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Post by Xavier Williams on Jul 3, 2008 22:13:40 GMT -6
All I'm saying is, he's lost more big time matches int he last 2-3 years, than he has won. And he has done more than enough to make the people he goes against look good
Orton, Cena, and Hardy are at the top of the list. For the fact the he is married to Steph... I'm sorry HHH has been champ for... 2 months and couple with holding the belt for 2 hours and not being champ for 2 years.
COmpare that to Cena, Orton and Edge, yeah being married to Steph really helped him out.
And why not Show or Y2J, because they dont draw.
Seriously, STOP with the 2005-'06, complaints. HHH and Cena are doing what Rock and Austin did in the 90's, beat everyone and win titles.
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Post by jlhfan69 on Jul 3, 2008 22:16:39 GMT -6
To the Triple H haters... read World Wrestling Insanity. You'll get a gas from it.
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Post by Adam on Jul 3, 2008 23:11:33 GMT -6
All I'm saying is, he's lost more big time matches int he last 2-3 years, than he has won. And he has done more than enough to make the people he goes against look good Orton, Cena, and Hardy are at the top of the list. For the fact the he is married to Steph... I'm sorry HHH has been champ for... 2 months and couple with holding the belt for 2 hours and not being champ for 2 years. COmpare that to Cena, Orton and Edge, yeah being married to Steph really helped him out. And why not Show or Y2J, because they dont draw. Seriously, STOP with the 2005-'06, complaints. HHH and Cena are doing what Rock and Austin did in the 90's, beat everyone and win titles. You win..... I'll just ignore his entire career, and only focus on what you tell me I'm allowed to focus on. That better?
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Post by Ricky Johnson on Jul 4, 2008 0:55:40 GMT -6
if he likes you, he'll put you over. Exactly. That's completely unprofessional. You may to put over someone you don't like. It's pretty much LIFE. You have to work with people you may not exactly like, but you still have to work with them. Would you go out of your way to make sure that guy didn't get a promotion? even though he works hard? That's kind of ****ty when someone has so much power WHO IS NOT THE OWNER, that they can decide SOMEONE ELSE'S career. Do I hate HHH? No. I just find it kind of funny that he wields the power to decide careers, and picks and chooses. It shouldn't be a choice based on what someone with power thinks. Imagine if Bret Hart, who had a lot of stroke in the mid '90's said "Stone Cold...., We're going out there, and I'm squashing you in 5 minutes. In the re-match, I'm going squash you again...because I don't think you'll get over. I need to win." And said the same thing to everybody else he faced. I'd think "wow, that guy's a prick." HHH pretty much does that. I'm not saying the guy doesn't put anyone over...far from it. He has put a large share of guys over, Batista being the most famous. But it's VERY few and far between. Hell, he single handedly CHANGED the main event of WM24. He just HAD to be in the main event. He just HAD to win the world title again [albeit a month later]. He just HAD to have a long title run. I mean, doesn't that strike you as odd? HHH is gold on the mic, and a superior wrestler. but a lot less superior as he makes himself out to be. He picks as chooses as has been said, but isn't the whole idea behind doing so to keep the business going? That's my point here. I'm not hating the man himself. But he just seems to be very selfish IMO.
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Jon Michaels
Rookie
Once killed a moose, with a q-tip
Posts: 81
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Post by Jon Michaels on Jul 4, 2008 6:28:22 GMT -6
Ya know, he's such a main event whore, even though he hadn't had a meaningful title reign before this one since WM 24.
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JFK
Full Member
The dominant gene.
Posts: 547
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Post by JFK on Jul 4, 2008 11:24:52 GMT -6
hhh=monies
y2j= no monies
you draw you get placed on top you dont you get shuffled to the bottom thats the bottom line.
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Post by jlhfan69 on Jul 4, 2008 12:07:48 GMT -6
Actually... Jericho drew pretty good ratings while champion.
Credit goes to JD Dunn at 411mania.
So back in 2002, Triple H was a better draw for Raw while Jericho did more for Smackdown. I wish I could find the PPV buyrates off hand.
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Post by Cliff Clinton on Jul 4, 2008 12:31:10 GMT -6
I blame it on Jerichos hair cut.
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JFK
Full Member
The dominant gene.
Posts: 547
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Post by JFK on Jul 4, 2008 12:40:01 GMT -6
then not now.
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Post by Dante Cross on Jul 4, 2008 13:33:11 GMT -6
hhh=monies y2j= no monies you draw you get placed on top you dont you get shuffled to the bottom thats the bottom line. Unless of course,Triple H actually has it out for you, there is a documented hatred between Jercho and Trips. While I can't say Jericho did or did not draw as champion. How could you expect him to when the entire time as champion, he was made to look like a fool, with guys like Maven who was at the very bottom of the tatem pole getting the better of him in title matches. How can you draw, when you're booked to look like a joke, and a entire wrestlemania main event that you're booked in, isn't even about you, It's about Trips and Nipple H, where Jericho only in the picture to walk their freaking dog.
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